On Sat, 9 May 1998, Justin Wagner wrote:
> SINCE the home product has come out... I've run into a LOT of people
> praising the quality of the results... and a lot of people mentioning
> how they did a part at home for a fraction of what the pro shops
> wanted...I'm sorry, maybe I missed something in my business school
> background... but when someone comes along and offers a home product
> that can do for $5.00 what the local "pro's" want $60.00 or more for...
> I'd say... it's a threat... a multi-million dollar threat...
Don't forget that the $60 (or whatever) charged by the pros includes prep
costs and labor, plus something toward the cost of the equipment used.
These are the most expensive componants any time you pay to have work like
this done. It isn't a ripoff, as some here have implied, it's a simple
matter of the professional powder coater passing his costs along to the
customer and adding a bit for profit. Any business has to do that to stay
in business. When you buy the Eastwood kit you are paying for materials
plus some amount for Eastwood's profit, but you are not paying the labor
costs for prepping the piece and applying the coating, nor are you paying
towards equipment. You provide the labor and equipment.
> I do agree that PREP is important here... but even the advertisement in
> EASTWOOD shows a sandblasted "before" part... and explains that it needs
> to be prepped well... To suggest that the home auto enthusiasts...
> would not know how to follow directions and prep a part is sort of
> misplaced... I mean... these guys take engines apart and put them back
> together again... they... WE... know all about various media blasting...
> and auto paint prep procedures......
>
> I can't see how a few people screwing up the home process are going to
> extend that disappointment into the entire powdercoat industry! The
> quality of the professional powder coat industry is already known and
> accepted... If anything... bad experiences with the home product would
> only bolster the professional business! But I don't think those bad
> experiences that you're suggesting are going to be the rule... they are
> going to be the exception. When an enthusiast screws up a part, due to
> bad prep... he'll sandblast the part, and follow the directions the
> second time around.
I wish I could be as optimistic about the abilities of the average BritCar
owner as you are. I've been involved in the hobby for many years, mostly
as just another enthusiast but also on occasion as a business venture and
as a supplier of technical guidance. I've seen too many botched jobs
resulting from lack of experience and/or unwillingness or inability to
read and follow instructions. You're correct that in most cases the
response is to say "Well, I sure screwed that up", then start over.
But these days there is an increasing trend toward blaming others for our
own mistakes. We see it here in the various autox.team.net mailing lists
fairly often, where someone buys a part from a Moss, TRF, or whomever,
installs it only to have it go bad, and blames it on the parts supplier.
Now, that same part has been used successfully by hundreds of other
buyers, and of course it's possible that this one person got a defective
example of the part, but more likeley he just plain bothched the job. He
then badmouths the supplier here on the autox.team.net BritCar lists, and
others believe him. This hurts the parts supplier's credibility.
We've also all seen many examples of how rapidly misinformation spreads
via these BritCar lists and is accepted as fact. The old wives' tale about
DOT3 brake fluid comes immediately to mind...
Bringing it closer to home (for me at least), I see this phenomenon every
day in my business. I run a low-cost Internet access service with about
5500 customers, 99% of whom are very happy with the service we provide.
The other 1%, for various reasons, have trouble making connections,
trouble browsing the Web, trouble with their computers in general.
According to them it's all our fault. They can't (or won't) understand
that if several thousand other customers use the service without problems,
then most likely their difficulties are their own doing. They aren't
willing to take responsibility for their own problems, but they are very
willing to badmouth us to anyone who will listen. Consequently every
disatisfied customer, even if he/she is the real cause of his
disatisfaction, costs us many potential customers. I spend a lot of time
doing damage control as a result, and I can appreciate that Doug feels he
is potentially in that position regarding the effects of DIY
powdercoating.
I don't blame Doug for worrying about the effect of DIY powdercoat kits on
the professional powdercoat industry. He's not worrying about the
existance of the kits as a threat to the industry in terms of volume of
business. He's worrying about the effect of botched DIY powdercoating on
the credibility of the industry as a whole. I don't blame him.
> I think there was a "mystery and magic" to this process that was closely
> held, in general, (not necessarily a conspiracy though!) to keep the
> enthusiasts coming back, time and time again, to pay big bucks for what
> was ultimately, an inexpensive process.
You DO make it sound like a conspiracy, especially when comparing the DIY
cost to the cost of professional application. I've already talked about
that, so won't repeat myself.
> Your first post almost made it sound like we should all disregard the
> home product and stand by our local professionals... regardless of the
> costs involved... it was difficult to see it as a post that was just
> trying to protect us from disapointment. Maybe it's just how I read
> it.
I don't recall seeing Doug or anyone else here saying that the Eastwood
kit is junk. What I HAVE seen is an attempt to make sure everyone here
understands the potential pitfalls of DIY application. That's entirely
appropriate on a list of this type.
> It seems to me... that if you really care about all your "fellow
> hobbists" ... you'd be offering up the powder to sell, in smaller
> minimum quanities, at prices much better than Eastwood!
It probably isn't possible for the major bulk suppliers of powder coating
materials to do that profitably. They are geared toward selling in large
bulk quantities, and would find it very expensive to provide kits similar
to Eastwood's. Eastwood can buy the materials in bulk at relatively low
cost. They are already involved in supplying kits of various types on the
consumer market, so putting together and retailing their powdercoating
kits is relatively easy for them to do.
> Secondly...
> you'd be including with your powder supplies, perhaps, clear directions
> on how to get optimum results at home. Or maybe you could have a
> website where enthusiasts could download these recommendations... (that
> are, perhaps, more extensive than EASTWOOD's directions) along with some
> sources for the powder... (maybe not directly from you, the
> manufacterer, but from some of your distributors!) Wouldn't this be
> the better approach? Or did I, once again, miss something?
Agreed. Doug has already offered to put together some powdercoating info
for the list, and I'm looking forward to seeing it. I'd like to see a
description of the process from start to finish as done in a professional
shop, along with tips on how the wannabe DIY powdercoater can most closely
duplicate those shop conditions and techniques at home.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Chip Old 1948 M.G. TC TC6710 NEMGTR #2271
Cub Hill, Maryland 1962 Triumph TR4 CT3154LO
fold@bcpl.net
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