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Well, today I took one of the Voltage Stabilizers apart. No not the one in
the car but one from an old Alpine. Folks, the design and implementation
are NOT rocket science, lol. The internals look as described in the shop
manual. But everything is on a miniscule scale. The post where the input
power is applied is the attachment for a u shaped piece that goes around a
binding post for the wire coil inside. The input post is like one leg of the
letter U. The other leg has the absolutely dinky points. And that leg is
wrapped with wire that makes a hair look large by comparison (artistic
license taken here, but it is very small). The U shaped piece is very very
thin. After looking at it and fiddling with it, I still do not see exactly
how it works. I suspect that the heater wire is non functional though. I'll
measure tomorrow.
Now, as I keep mentioning, I am no sparky. Electrical stuff makes me want to
scream loudly. But I see that there are lots of voltage regulators on ebay
and I have in the past purchased and used some of them. Most are PWM motor
supplies but can be dial in to deliver a regulated voltage. Mast are dirt
cheap coming from you know where. Seems to me that one of these would also
work if it is just 10 volts out put that is needed. Heck there might even be
an Arduino board that would do the trick also. What about a 10 volt dc-dc
power supply?
Thoughts?
mayf
From: Don Antilla [mailto:fast427@sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Friday, September 23, 2016 9:30 AM
To: drmayf@mayfco.com
Subject: voltage regulator- Don's suggestions
Hi Mayf:
Gary suggested I send you my thoughts.
Regards,
Don Antilla
On 9/22/16, 12:02 PM, "Don Antilla" <fast427@sbcglobal.net
Gary:
These are simple devices as you most probably know.
The theory is that the duty cycle of the contacts open/closed is preset
so an average of around 7-10 volts (forgot which, but not important to this
part of the troubleshooting) is achieved over a longer sample period.
Since the original Ford gauges react slowly by design on order to not have
a jittery pointer, they are intentionally designed as thermal gauges that
heat up slightly as a function of the average 12/0/12/0/12. volt
open/closed points.
Since there is no significant energy that needs to be dissipated when the
instruments are powered by the open/closed bimetal strip, there is no
benefit to add any capacitor to the circuit. The points open/closing do
not even bother the old fashioned radios in almost all cases.
I've been reading the posts and I should add that one of the more common
causes of it not working is failure to properly GROUND the case of the
mini regulator./ You must ground it because the incoming 12 volts that
heats up the bimetal strip depends on the case of the regulator being
grounded in order to heat up the bimetal strip and cause it to open and
close.
If no ground, then the full 100% duty cycle voltage is sent to the gauges
resulting in improper readings.
If I were to check one of these regulators, I'd check for continuity from
the tab on the case to the INPUT 12 volt terminal; you should see the
resistance of the heating coil inside the regulator.
Then, with no power to the regulator, I'd look for continuity of the 12
volt Input terminal to the Output terminal
Don Antilla
203 264-8301 Home
203 592-8427 Cell
On 9/22/16, 11:01 AM, "Tigers on behalf of Gary Winblad via Tigers"
I've never had one fail so I don't know.
If you are sure yours is bad, take it apart and let us all know, I am
curious too.
The current is low, I would guess the heating wire might have opened up
and
could possibly be re connected.
Gary
On 9/21/2016 9:32 PM, Larry Mayfield via Tigers wrote:
You know I have been thinking about that little sucker. Just what is
in it to go bad? The points? Or. Why does it fail. Would a capacitor
in the circuit help in the output to prevent flyback voltages (there
is an inductor in the loop a lot like points and ignition coil)? Not
a sparky, but curious.
Whadda I know.
mayf
Don Antilla
203 264-8301 Home
203 592-8427 Cell
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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue =
vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#1F497D'>Well, today I took one of the Voltage =
Stabilizers apart. No not the one in the car but one from an old =
Alpine. Folks, the design and implementation are NOT rocket =
science, lol. The internals look as described in the shop manual. But =
everything is on a miniscule scale. The post where the input power is =
applied is the attachment for a u shaped piece that goes around a =
binding post for the wire coil inside. The input post is like one leg of =
the letter U. The other leg has the absolutely dinky points. And =
that leg is wrapped with wire that makes a hair look large by comparison =
(artistic license taken here, but it is very small). The U =
shaped piece is very very thin. After looking at it and fiddling =
with it, I still do not see exactly how it works. I suspect that the =
heater wire is non functional though. I’ll measure tomorrow… =
<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>Now, as I keep =
mentioning, I am no sparky. Electrical stuff makes me want to scream =
loudly. But I see that there are lots of voltage regulators on ebay and =
I have in the past purchased and used some of them. Most are PWM motor =
supplies but can be dial in to deliver a regulated voltage. Mast =
are dirt cheap coming from you know where. Seems to me that one of these =
would also work if it is just 10 volts out put that is needed. Heck =
there might even be an Arduino board that would do the trick also. =
What about a 10 volt dc-dc power supply? =
<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>Thoughts? =
<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#1F497D'>mayf<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><a name=3D"_MailEndCompose"><span =
style=3D'color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></a></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>From:</span><=
/b><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'> =
Don Antilla [mailto:fast427@sbcglobal.net] <br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, =
September 23, 2016 9:30 AM<br><b>To:</b> =
drmayf@mayfco.com<br><b>Subject:</b> voltage regulator- Don's =
suggestions<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><i><span style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Comic =
Sans MS";color:black'>Hi Mayf:</span></i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans =
MS";color:black'> Gary suggested I send you my =
thoughts.</span></i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans =
MS";color:black'>Regards,</span></i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:black'>Don =
Antilla</span></i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>On =
9/22/16, 12:02 PM, "Don Antilla" <<a =
href=3D"mailto:fast427@sbcglobal.net";>fast427@sbcglobal.net</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in =
4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in' =
id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE"><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Gar=
y:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>The=
se are simple devices as you most probably =
know.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>The=
theory is that the duty cycle of the contacts open/closed is =
preset <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>so =
an average of around 7-10 volts (forgot which, but not important to this =
part of the troubleshooting) is achieved over a longer sample =
period.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Sin=
ce the original Ford gauges react slowly by design on order to not =
have <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>a =
jittery pointer, they are intentionally designed as thermal gauges =
that <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>hea=
t up slightly as a function of the average 12/0/12/0/12… =
volt <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>ope=
n/closed points.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Sin=
ce there is no significant energy that needs to be dissipated when =
the <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>ins=
truments are powered by the open/closed bimetal strip, there is =
no <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>ben=
efit to add any capacitor to the circuit. The points open/closing =
do <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>not=
even bother the old fashioned radios in almost all =
cases.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>I&#=
8217;ve been reading the posts and I should add that one of the more =
common <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>cau=
ses of it not working is failure to properly GROUND the case of =
the <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>min=
i regulator./ You must ground it because the incoming 12 volts =
that <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>hea=
ts up the bimetal strip depends on the case of the regulator =
being <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>gro=
unded in order to heat up the bimetal strip and cause it to open =
and <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>clo=
se.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>If =
no ground, then the full 100% duty cycle voltage is sent to the =
gauges <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>res=
ulting in improper readings.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>If =
I were to check one of these regulators, I’d check for continuity =
from <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>the=
tab on the case to the INPUT 12 volt terminal; you should see =
the <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>res=
istance of the heating coil inside the =
regulator.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>The=
n, with no power to the regulator, I’d look for continuity of the =
12 <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>vol=
t Input terminal to the Output =
terminal<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Don=
Antilla<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>203=
264-8301 Home<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>203=
592-8427 Cell<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>On =
9/22/16, 11:01 AM, "Tigers on behalf of Gary Winblad via =
Tigers" <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><=
;<a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net";>tigers-bounces@autox.team.n=
et</a> on behalf of <a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net";>tigers@autox.team.net</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in =
4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in' =
id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE"><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>I'v=
e never had one fail so I don't know.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>If =
you are sure yours is bad, take it apart and let us all know, I =
am <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>cur=
ious too.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>The=
current is low, I would guess the heating wire might have opened =
up <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>and=
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>cou=
ld possibly be re connected.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Gar=
y<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>On =
9/21/2016 9:32 PM, Larry Mayfield via Tigers =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in =
4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in' =
id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE"><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>You=
know I have been thinking about that little sucker. Just =
what is <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>in =
it to go bad? The points? Or. Why does it fail. Would a =
capacitor <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>in =
the circuit help in the output to prevent flyback voltages =
(there <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>is =
an inductor in the loop a lot like points and ignition =
coil)? Not <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>a =
sparky, but curious.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Wha=
dda I know…<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>may=
f<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><div>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal><i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans =
MS";color:black'> Don Antilla</span></i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:black'>203 =
264-8301 Home</span></i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:black'>203 =
592-8427 Cell</span></i><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div></div></div></body></html>
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