I can't accurately speak to car inlines as my research did not include
those. It's entirely possible the car 235 had another variant oiling system
for the rockers. From looking at the truck documentation, it looks like the
coil mounting holes are inches from the oil galley that supplies the
rockers, however some years show this, and others do not.
As far as hydraulic lifters go, the block I used in my '50 truck originally
had hydraulic lifters in it (a 1961 block -- I believe this was the last
year for these types in inlines), but I stuck 58 and later mechanical
lifters in because it is a performance engine. No needed modifications of
the block or head to accommodate the mechanical lifters. I've run both
types in hydraulic blocks without the line you state, and have had no
trouble with the mechanical lifters (oil at the rockers fine, and oil
pressure was fine). I'd be interested in hearing more detail about the line
so that I better understand the reasoning.
On another note, I've never been able to find a hydraulic lifter for a 235
(261) that will survive for any length of time. I ask a fair bit in
performance, and I don't think the quality is out there right now. That's
why I always install a mechanical tappit. For a street driver, they may
perform ok -- perhaps another area for investigation.
Allen in Seattle
'50 3100
----- Original Message -----
From: "William Schickling" <wschick1@twcny.rr.com>
To: "Allen Jones" <jonesal@u.washington.edu>; "Old Truck List"
<oletrucks@autox.team.net>
Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 7:33 PM
Subject: RE: [oletrucks] 235 oiling ?
> Allen,
>
> Get this. I never thought I would end up in this thread.
>
> I have no idea how this fits in. I have rebuilt a 1960 235 from a car to
put
> into my truck. Like the engine that was described I do not have plugs in
the
> side of the engine, behind the lifter cover, to run an oil line. So I am
> forced to stay with hydraulic lifters. You need that line to run solid
> lifters.
>
> I stuck and old distributor shaft to spin the oil pump to prime the oil
> passages and look for leaks. Since the engine is on the stand and not
ready
> to run I did not have the coil mounted to the side of the head. After I
spun
> the oil pump for a bit I went around looking for oil up in the rocker
shaft.
> I had oil on the outside of the head that came from the hole drilled for
> mounting the coil. I had to put a plug in it to keep spinning the pump.
> What the heck is that.
>
> I had everything magnafluxed. Is this anywhere close to normal.
>
> Bill Schickling
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-oletrucks@autox.team.net
> [mailto:owner-oletrucks@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Allen Jones
> Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 12:30 PM
> To: Old Truck List
> Subject: Re: [oletrucks] 235 oiling ?
>
>
> Turns out this is little more interesting than originally thought. I
pulled
> the GM factory manuals for Chevrolet trucks from 1957 to 1961 to see how
the
> rockers were oiled. Here is a concise summary -- I refer you to the shop
> manuals for the gritty details (where there are great schematics and
pics).
>
> 1957
> Lubrication of the rocker assembly is supplied by a drilled passage from
the
> rear camshaft bearing to a pipe located under the pushrod cover to a
fitting
> at the top of the cylinder block. The oil then flows through a vertical
> passage drilled in the cylinder block and head to the rocker mechanism oil
> connector pipe between the two hollow rocker shafts. A bleeder hole in
each
> rocker and supply pipe supplies oil to the valve stems and push rods.
> 1958
> For 1958, oil to the rockers is now supplied by passages from both the
front
> and rear cam bearings through a horizontal drilled passage in the block,
> then vertically up through the block and head, and into the rockers. No
> pipe is used for rocker oiling in 1958 (other than the rocker oil
connector
> from top of head to rocker shaft). There's a bold warning in the manual
not
> to install early 1957 tappets in a 1958 block as 1958 tappets have an
> annulus around the tappet that allows passage of oil to the rocker
assembly.
> 1959
> This is the year full pressure oiling was introduced to the rocker
assembly
> as stated in the manual. A 1/16" orifice located in the cylinder block
has
> been drilled to 11/32" diameter to control flow. The over flow end of the
> rocker oil connecter has been closed to sustain oil pressure in the rocker
> shaft. The oil grove annulus in each rocker arm has been decreased in
depth
> and relocated.
> 1960
> 1960 is similar to 1959.
> 1961
> This is a supplement manual to the 1960 manual and it states: "A new
valve
> rocker shaft support, with a 1/8" horizontal slot located on the side of
the
> shaft bore towards the rockers, is installed on the cylinder head at the
> front and rear positions. This new valve rocker shaft support, along with
a
> newly designed soil connector tube, improves the durability of the valve
> train." That's all it states.
>
> Note that the 57 to 61 factory manuals make no mention of a hollow head
> bolt, nor do they differentiate between 235s or 261s. Note also I have
not
> disseminated information on hydraulic lifters.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> Allen in Seattle
> '50 3100
> '55 M38A1
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Allen Jones" <jonesal@u.washington.edu>
> To: "Rob J." <rjjmsj@earthlink.net>
> Sent: Monday, February 11, 2002 9:00 AM
> Subject: Re: [oletrucks] 235 oiling ?
>
>
> > Rob,
> >
> > I'll grab the '58 truck manual, find a scanner tonight, and email what
you
> > need. If I remember correctly, the oiling is supplied through a
special,
> > hollow head bolt in the center of the head (supplied through the block
> > casting), and a fitted pipe from the top of the head to the center of
the
> > rocker arm assembly (similar to my '61)...to be verified with the '58
> truck
> > manual. Did you notice one of these bolts on assembly? It would have a
> > hollow core with an exit hole an inch or three from the top. Can be
> plugged
> > sometimes making it hard to notice. Note that head and block would need
> to
> > be of the similar vintage for this set up. You may want to verify the
> year
> > of your block (embossed above the starter).
> >
> > Also, I couldn't find your head casting number on any of my lists...?
> >
> > Allen in Seattle
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Rob J." <rjjmsj@earthlink.net>
> > To: "_Oletrucks" <oletrucks@autox.team.net>
> > Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2002 11:02 AM
> > Subject: Re: [oletrucks] 235 oiling ?
> >
> >
> > > Allen,
> > >
> > > The number on the head is 3837161. I was told it is a 58 engine. I
> > > currently have the external line, but would like to get rid of that if
> > > possible. What I need to know, is how the oiling was supposed to have
> > been
> > > done originally.
> > >
> > > Hope this is enough info, if not let me know.
> > >
> > > Rob
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Allen Jones
> > > To: Rob J. ; _Oletrucks
> > > Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2002 10:19 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [oletrucks] 235 oiling ?
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Rob,
> > >
> > > What year truck are you working on (or what year are striving for
> > > originality) and what is the casting number of the head you have?
> This
> > > information will help to better answer your question.
> > >
> > > Allen in Seattle
> > > '50 3100
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Rob J." <rjjmsj@earthlink.net>
> > > To: "_Oletrucks" <oletrucks@autox.team.net>
> > > Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 6:22 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [oletrucks] 235 oiling ?
> > >
> > >
> > > > I think I may have given the wrong idea of what I need. I already
> > have
> > > the
> > > > modified external line from the "T" fitting the oil pressure guage
> is
> > > hooked
> > > > into...the line from there runs around the block to the other side
> and
> > > > enters mid block near the top to provide oil to the rockers. What
I
> > am
> > > > wanting, is a picture of the setup that is supposed to be in place
> > > behind
> > > > the lifter cover. All I have behind mine, is the plugged point
(the
> > > picture
> > > > I put the link to, has arrows to show what is going on and what
is,
> I
> > > think,
> > > > missing)...ie. no line whatsoever...and what I'd like to do, is to
> try
> > > to
> > > > eliminate the external line and do it the way it was intended to
be
> > > done...
> > > >
> > > > A couple of others have also offered advise on how to do the
> external
> > > line,
> > > > so you aren't the only one who misunderstood what I wanted....so
I'm
> > > sure
> > > it
> > > > is my fault for not describing better.
> > > >
> > > > Anyway, what I need, is information on the way the engine was
> > originally
> > > > intended to provide oil to the rockers (my belief, is there is
> > supposed
> > > to
> > > > be some type of a feed line behind the lifters cover, and THAT is
> what
> > I
> > > > need information on).
> > > >
> > > > Rob
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: Mike Baggese
> > > > To: _Oletrucks ; Rob J.
> > > > Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 5:41 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: [oletrucks] 235 oiling ?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Rob,
> > > >
> > > > My digi camera is a el-cheeeeepo, and my '59 is put away with
> > > low-light
> > > > conditions, so I won't be able to take a pic that'd be worth
> > wasting
> > > > bandwidth to send you.
> > > >
> > > > I can take a look at it tomorrow and explain the routing for
> > > you...not
> > > > too difficult as I recall, the input to the oil filter is tee'ed
> off
> > > with
> > > > 3/16th? copper tubing and routed up with the fuel line in front
of
> > the
> > > > head, around to the side of the head.
> > > >
> > > > I'll do a re-check tomorrow and let you know for sure...need
to
> > fire
> > > the
> > > > old beast up anyways.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > [Original Message]
> > > > > From: Rob J. <rjjmsj@earthlink.net>
> > > > > To: _Oletrucks <oletrucks@autox.team.net>
> > > > > Date: 2/9/02 8:55:44 AM
> > > > > Subject: Re: [oletrucks] 235 oiling ?
> > > > >
> > > > > Any chance you (or anyone else), can send me a digital picture
> of
> > > the
> > > > setup?
> > > > > rjjmsj@earthlink.net
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: Mike Baggese
> > > > > To: _Oletrucks ; _Old-chevy-truck ; Rob J.
> > > > > Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 12:00 AM
> > > > > Subject: RE: [oletrucks] 235 oiling ?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > My understanding is that it was a "mechanic mod" at first.
> Then
> > > > later,
> > > > > either the dealers or the factory did the work.
> > > > >
> > > > > I have it on my '59 235, but it's not been done on a '55
or
> > '56
> > > 235
> > > > I
> > > > > have in the barn.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > [Original Message]
> > > > > > From: Rob J. <rjjmsj@earthlink.net>
> > > > > > To: _Old-chevy-truck <old-chevy-truck@onelist.com>;
> _Oletrucks
> > > > > <oletrucks@autox.team.net>
> > > > > > Date: 2/9/02 7:58:40 AM
> > > > > > Subject: [oletrucks] 235 oiling ?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I seem to recall from a previous thread, that there is
> > supposed
> > > to
> > > > be
> > > > an
> > > > > > oiling line behind the tappet cover. I finally had a
reason
> > to
> > > > remove
> > > > > my
> > > > > > cover, and took a picture (see link below). What I don't
> > > recall,
> > > is
> > > > > whether
> > > > > > or not this line was present in ALL 235 engines regardless
> of
> > > > whether
> > > > or
> > > > > not
> > > > > > they were solid or hydraulic, or maybe only present in
those
> > > with
> > > > solid
> > > > > > lifters, but not hydraulics (and vice versa), or maybe
only
> in
> > > > certain
> > > > > > years. In the picture, the green arrow points to a plug
in
> > what
> > > I
> > > > > suspect
> > > > > > is an oil gallery going to the rocker arms, but in my
case,
> is
> > > > plugged
> > > > > off
> > > > > > and not being used. I would think that somewhere in the
> > yellow
> > > > > highlighted
> > > > > > area, should be another plug, but in my case, there is
> > nothing,
> > > ie.
> > > > not
> > > > > > holes that I can see. I have had to route an external oil
> > line
> > > from
> > > > the
> > > > > > rear of the block on the opposite side, around the back of
> the
> > > > block,
> > > > > and
> > > > > > plumb it into the rocker arm oiling setup at the green
> arrow.
> > > While
> > > > > this
> > > > > > end-around approach has worked and gets good oil to the
> > rockers,
> > > as
> > > > long
> > > > > as
> > > > > > I have the engine down and being worked on, I thought that
> > maybe
> > > I
> > > > could
> > > > > fix
> > > > > > the lack of the oil line behind the cover. If anyone
knows
> > what
> > > > should
> > > > > be
> > > > > > there, and whether or not I could maybe tap a line in by
> > > drilling
> > > > into
> > > > > the
> > > > > > yellow area and tapping the hole for a fitting, or knows
of
> > > anyway
> > > > to
> > > > > get
> > > > > > rid of the external oil line, I would appreciate
discussing
> > this
> > > > with
> > > > > you.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/old-chevy-truck/files/Image07a.jpg
> > > > > > oletrucks is devoted to Chevy and GM trucks built between
> 1941
> > > and
> > > > 1959
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- Mike
> > > > > --- passnb4u@earthlink.net
> > > > > --- EarthLink: The #1 provider of the Real Internet.
> > > > > oletrucks is devoted to Chevy and GM trucks built between
1941
> > and
> > > > 1959
> > > > > oletrucks is devoted to Chevy and GM trucks built between 1941
> and
> > > 1959
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- Mike
> > > > --- passnb4u@earthlink.net
> > > > --- EarthLink: The #1 provider of the Real Internet.
> > > > oletrucks is devoted to Chevy and GM trucks built between 1941 and
> > 1959
> > > oletrucks is devoted to Chevy and GM trucks built between 1941 and
1959
> oletrucks is devoted to Chevy and GM trucks built between 1941 and 1959
oletrucks is devoted to Chevy and GM trucks built between 1941 and 1959
|
