I try to stay out of these 'religious' issues. I lived in Casper as the jobs
were eliminated.
I also work for the company that Gene Davis works for (based on his
description). At least
I worked for them the last time I looked. You know the drill. Outsourcing
and layoffs, and
downsizeing, etc. Now there is another way to make money - just relieve
yourself of one of
your greatest expences - payroll and long term benefits (people). There are
many ways to
make money and some are not pleaseant however I do not subscribe to the
"conspiracy /
price fixing / murderer" ideas.
How about we talk about "ol' trucks"?
Lonnie
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene Davis <genedavis@tritel.net>
To: Lewis Osborn <losborn@teleport.com>
Cc: <oletrucks@autox.team.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 1999 10:47 AM
Subject: Re: [oletrucks] Gas prices.....perspective
> Lewis Osborn wrote:
> >
> > Tuesday, July 27, 1999, 10:45:36 PM, Gene wrote:
> >
> > > Lewis Osborn wrote:
> > <snip>
> > >> Well, here's a different perspective. I still think that gasoline
has gone up
> > >> less in the past 75 years than most anything else you can find,
(except, of
> > >> course, computers, etc) but gouging is gouging. If I worked at an
oil
> > >> facility these days, I'd be looking over my shoulder. After decades
with
> > >> virtually no losses, the industry is losing one every couple of
weeks - and,
> > >> each time they loose one, the price at the pump pops at least a
nickel. The
> > >> only times that the price at the pumps has gone up in the past forty
years has
> > >> been due to various crisis - mostly created and/or unsubstantiated.
> > <snip>
> > > What do you mean by "losing one every couple of weeks"? Losing one of
> > > what? What is an oil facility? Yeah, I work in the oil industry, and
> >
> > I don't have the details at my fingertips, but from memory: Two
refinery
> > explosions in California (the Bay Area?) just before the first recent
hike in
> > prices. Then, just as prices started back down, a pipeline in northern
> > Washington State had a spill and a fire, killing a couple of bystanders,
I
> > believe, and prices went up again. They eased off again, and, from bits
and
> > pieces I caught on the news, some other refinery had a problem of some
sort,
> > and the prices are up again. I'm not making accusations, I'm recounting
> > recent events.
> >
> > > yeah, I'm looking over my shoulder, but who isnt these days. I'm not
> > > going to defend the industry too much one way or another, at least not
> > > right now, but from what I understand, they can get close to one
barrel
> > > of gas from one barrel of crude. But the equipment it takes to do it
> >
> > I don't pretend to know much about oil refining, but the kerosene,
diesel, and
> > other "stuff" have to come from somewhere in that barrel.
> >
> > > costs money to buy and operate. Yeah, oil companys make alot of
money,
> > > so do car companys, construction companys, etc. Can you still buy a
car
> > > or house for the same price you could 10 years ago?
> >
> > No, and, if you look at my post again, you'll see that I stated that,
IMO, the
> > price of gasoline has risen less in the last 75 years than most other
things,
> > but, due to the methods used to justify the price increases, I have to
wonder
> > if the increases were justified by increasing production costs. It
_could_ be
> > like Bill Gates limiting the supply of Windows, then raising the price
on that
> > limited supply.
> >
> > > I have a hard time believing in any industry contrived or created
> > > crisises, the guys I've seen that run these outfits cant get along
well
> > > enough to do things that are sure to benefit the industry, let alone
> > > secretly conspire to raise the prices. What happened all those times
> > > the price was so low, that a conspiracy too? 1-1-99 gas was $0.95 in
> > > WY. Now it is around $1.25. We pay about $0.30 in taxes. Fairly low
> > > compared to other states, but still!
> >
> > "Conspiracy" being a Politicaly Incorrect term these days, I'd refer to
it as
> > antitrust and price fixing. The guys at the top of the various
companies
> > don't get along? Don't kid yourself. They may even serve on each
others'
> > boards, and they are certainly friendly with each other. Company
loyalty to
> > them is just part of their sales strategy. While the "worker bees" have
true
> > company loyalty, the execs with the 6- and 7-figure and up incomes
> > can work for one company this month and another company next month,
taking
> > their golden parachute with them each and every time. (This is true of
ALL
> > industries. For instance, when AT&T's Robert Allen decided to step
down, he
> > found a guy named John Walters, brought him on board, and started
grooming
> > him. 9 months later, Bob decided that John wasn't AT&T CEO material,
and sent
> > him down the road - with TWENTY-SEVEN MILLION DOLLARS of the
stockholders'
> > money.) Look around and you can find other examples for yourself.
> >
> > > Sorry, I know this aint ole truck related, but I had to say something!
> >
> > Don'cher truck run on gas? And don't ya need that paycheck to keep it
on the
> > road? :-)
> >
> > > Gene Davis
> > > '58 GMC 100
> > > NAPCO
> >
> > Lewis - K7LVO - Medford - Valley of the Rogue - OR
> > The Forty - 1940 Chevy Pickup - One Owner
> > http://www.teleport.com/~losborn/1940.html
> >
> > oletrucks is devoted to Chevy and GM trucks built between 1941 and 1959
>
> I really dont care a bunch about this issue, but do get tired of the
> conspiracy theory stuff related to oil companys. Politicaly incorrect
> or not, what you are talking about is a conspiracy theory. You site the
> refinery and pipeline troubles that cause the upward trend in prices,
> and still basicly accuse the oil co's of price fixing. If people died,
> as in the pipeline explosion, you are basicly calling somebody a
> murderer. Pretty strong accusations if I'm reading you right.
>
> Yes, these directors serve on the boards of other companys, but you have
> to look real hard to find any oil company board of directors with the
> chairman of another oil co. on it, 2 chairs might serve together on the
> same board of a company like Motorola, or Westinghouse, but they very
> rarely are on the boards of other oil co.'s, in fact though I dont know
> all the facts about all the oils, it would surprise me greatly to see it
> at all.
>
> Then we can talk stock options. May of these "incentive" plans are
> linked to company performance in relation to industry peers. i.e. your
> company has to place at or near the top of the field of other oil co's
> in order for you to exercise your option. Even leaving ego out, this is
> a huge incentive to keep one up on your competitor. Markets, not
> conspiracy, set the prices of commoditys, including gas. If these guys
> are so smart, they would just steadily increase the price, instead of
> permitting these wild fluxuations that piss people off. They are that
> smart, and would love to have the means to do this, but there are just
> too many factors to control. If you really want something to blame,
> blame government and environmentalists for keeping prices high. Casper
> Wy. had 3 refineries in '80, now there is one. Salt Lake City had 7
> refinerys in '80, now there are 3. Thank you EPA and the clean air act,
> parts 1 and 2!. Hey, I like clean air! I'm willing to pay more for gas
> to keep clean air, but lets keep the "more" a reasonable amount. And we
> wont even get into taxes.
>
> Dont get me wrong, I'm not defending CEO's. The outfit I work for just
> merged, as they say, (read friendly take-over) by British Petroleum.
> The big winner, from what I see, was the chairman and CEO. He had a
> pile of stock, that suddenly was worth 25% more than a month before.
> Not to mention any parachute he might have had. However, anyone with
> stock benifited somewhat.
>
> Yeah, the ole truck runs on gas, which costs the same as it did when I
> graduated High School in '81. Yeah, the paycheck is nice, but if I dont
> get it here, I'll get it somewhere else.
>
> Gene Davis
> '58 GMC 100
> Napco
> oletrucks is devoted to Chevy and GM trucks built between 1941 and 1959
>
oletrucks is devoted to Chevy and GM trucks built between 1941 and 1959
|