Pete, Great stuff.
There are, of course, various versions of English language & they vary a
bit. Can you honestly tell me that "the owner" did not intend this to be
his K3 when he says the following in Coys listing.
"In the early '90's the car was purchased by it's enthusiastic owner as the
ideal basis on which to fulfil his long held dream of owning a factory
pointed tail spec. K3."
No sir. He does claim that this was his way of owning a K3. He did not
want a slab tank spec factory K3 he wanted "a factory pointed tail spec.
K3." - his own quote.
But that is not the point I was trying to make about Replicas. That car is
not, was not and can never be a K3 or a K3 replica or a Replica K3.
Read the Oxford Dictionary definition of FAKE :- to tamper with, to do up
for the purpose of deception. So if you take an original chassis & tamper
with it to make it look like a K3, it is a FAKE. I admit that is pretty
much what I am doing with my Racer built on a P-type chassis. However I am
not calling it a K3 or a P-type so I am not doing it for the purpose of
deception, rather for speed.
Now, I am very mindful of your car that has a factory supplied K-type
chassis as do both versions of K3015. These issues become somewhat
different from the common practise of the last 20 odd years of making a
factory supplied chassis into something different from what the factory
intended. I am also mindful of another K3 who had his chassis repaired by
the original "people" who made it for MG and a chap who was actually an
apprentice at that establishment in 1933 did the repair work. Can you get
any better than these examples of "factory produced" items which are not
fakes in their own right as a chassis.
So we have generated some interesting thoughts but no one has yet given a
any argument why cars made from non factory supplied chassis or factory
supplied chassis turned into something else should not be called what they
are - fakes. They are not "specials" or Replicas. They are fakes.
Best wishes.
Pip
AUSTRALIA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pete and Fran Thelander" <pthelander@earthlink.net>
To: "Pip Bucknell" <mgwizard@caloundra.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 06, 2002 11:36 AM
Subject: Re: another disput looming
> Pip
>
> These folks are playing it pretty close to the dividing line. They don't
> actually call it a K3, but certainly appear to be trying as hard as they
> dare to put you in position and let you leap to that assumption. I agree
> with your distinction that the originals were done BY THE FACTORY.
>
> One of the guys I've raced with here since my first races has (or I should
> say had) a Peter Gregory K3 boat tail repro. He wasn't bothered by the
> lack of a true racing history. He only wanted to enjoy racing a vintage
> style car. I met the new owner of the car and he sounded like he intended
> to continue to race it.
>
> Has also sold his three wheel Morgan. (I must say I had better luck
> against the Morgan than the K. The only substitute for cubic inches is
> boost pressure.) He is currently enamored with his recently acquired
> 1920's Vauxhaul.
>
> Enjoy the new year.
>
> Pete
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: Pip Bucknell <mgwizard@caloundra.net>
> > To: Pete and Fran Thelander <pthelander@earthlink.net>
> > Cc: MMM List UK <mg-mmm@autox.team.net>
> > Date: 1/5/02 5:03:16 PM
> > Subject: Re: another disput looming
> >
> > Pete, That's what it seems to be - purporting to be what it ain't.
> >
> > I agree with your earlier comments that MG did more or less the same
> thing.
> > That is converted or made something up.
> >
> > But that is the difference. It was done by MG.
> >
> > Anyone who does it now is FAKING IT - surely!
> >
> > Anyhow, it is interesting to hear a wide range of views.
> > Regards
> >
> > Pip
> > AUSTRALIA
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Pete and Fran Thelander" <pthelander@earthlink.net>
> > To: "MMM List UK" <mg-mmm@autox.team.net>; "Pip Bucknell"
> > <mgwizard@caloundra.net>
> > Sent: Sunday, January 06, 2002 10:00 AM
> > Subject: RE: another disput looming
> >
> >
> > > Pip
> > > Interesting that the Coys K type is listed with the chassis number
> K0147..
> > > The first K-type was Chassis No. K0251. Where did they get a number
> > before
> > > the beginning??? Maybe we need to see what information the restorer
can
> > > offer.
> > > Pete
> > >
> > >
> > > > [Original Message]
> > > > From: Pip Bucknell <mgwizard@caloundra.net>
> > > > To: MMM List UK <mg-mmm@autox.team.net>
> > > > Date: 1/5/02 3:15:08 PM
> > > > Subject: another disput looming
> > > >
> > > > My dear friends around the world.
> > > >
> > > > It was nice to see the pictures of the destroyed K1 and I thank you
> for
> > > the
> > > > listing. I am glad the PRESENT owner does not make it out to be a
K3.
> > So
> > > > many do. And what about future owners.
> > > >
> > > > However, to call it a meticulous "upgrade to K3 specifications" is
> > > somewhat
> > > > wide of the mark.
> > > >
> > > > I enjoyed Mr C Sherriff's comments as he accurately describes this
car
> > as
> > > a
> > > > FAKE. That is, it is purporting to be something that it is not.
> > > >
> > > > Perhaps you would all consider if it is time that we gave these cars
> > their
> > > > correct name. This car can only be a modified K1 or a K3 fake.
> Surely
> > > it is
> > > > not a replica.
> > > >
> > > > Our new Pre War MG Register Captain in Australia is grappling with
> these
> > > terms
> > > > and it will be interesting to learn what he decides on these
matters.
> > > >
> > > > I have said that I dislike the word "special" when describing MMM
> MG's.
> > > The
> > > > reasons is that, to me, all MMM cars were special. Some specially
> bad &
> > > some
> > > > specially good, but nun the less, still special. So when some one
> wants
> > > to
> > > > change a car from this group, to something that it was not
originally
> > > produced
> > > > to be by making "it" look like something else, isn't it truly a
FAKE.
> > > >
> > > > Well, today is Sunday and I guess it is time to leave you all to
> ponder
> > > those
> > > > words
> > > >
> > > > Best wishes to all for 2002.
> > > >
> > > > Pip Bucknell
> > > > AUSTRALIA
> > > >
> > > > /// unsubscribe/change address requests to majordomo@autox.team.net
> or
> > > try
> > > > /// http://www.team.net/cgi-bin/majorcool
> > > > /// http://www.team.net/mailman/listinfo
> > > > /// Archives at http://www.team.net/cgi-bin/wilma/mg-mmm
> > > > /// Send list postings to mg-mmm@autox.team.net
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- Pete and Fran Thelander
> > > --- pthelander@earthlink.net
> > >
> > > /// unsubscribe/change address requests to majordomo@autox.team.net
or
> > try
> > > /// http://www.team.net/cgi-bin/majorcool
> > > /// http://www.team.net/mailman/listinfo
> > > /// Archives at http://www.team.net/cgi-bin/wilma/mg-mmm
> > > /// Send list postings to mg-mmm@autox.team.net
> > >
> > >
>
>
>
> --- Pete and Fran Thelander
> --- pthelander@earthlink.net
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