Dave; At least for the Ford 302 I have a solution. It's called 289. On my 2
liter lotus and 3 liter Nissan I went to a .005 overbore which was within
the limits and cleaned up fine. Rich Fox
-----Original Message-----
From: Dave Dahlgren <ddahlgren@snet.net>
To: land-speed@autox.team.net <land-speed@autox.team.net>
Date: Tuesday, January 09, 2001 02:08 PM
Subject: Another great idea from the guy that brought you 300 e-mails on one
subject..
>This is long and may beg for the delete key so be warned..
>
>I have another great idea.. I know oh crap not this guy
>again.. But for those who like to race within a reasonable
>budget this will make sense although may be a nightmare for
>the rules guys..
>
>let me start with a couple of assumptions and yes i know how
>to parse the word into it's potential meaning.. seeing how
>this is a coed list will save the definition for another
>time for those that don't know or can e-mail me off list.
>
>1. LSR racing is for the most part a hobby that is done for
>the love of it.
>
>2. if you can find something inexpensive that is fun to
>drive and racey it has potential.
>
>3. better if you can find engines that actually came out of
>something and don't cost a kings ransom then they might
>have some potential even better if many are around in
>salvage yards or they just made a zillion of them and don't
>cost a lot for what you might be able to turn them into. Oh
>this is an engine thing as i am an engine guy and want to
>know little about fenders and such as that is a whole other
>issue.
>
>So here goes with the great idea..
>The problem..
>
>Many of the engine size breaks are right on the same size of
>most commonly produced engines before they become 'used and
>cheap'. the bores are worn out they need pistons crank
>ground etc..
>The current solution..
>
>If you want to build a D engine for instance. 2 engines show
>great promise. A 320 chevy or a 302 FORD( I used caps
>because I like FORDS).. Most of these engines need an
>overbore of .030 or more to clean up the bore and pistons
>are available to .060 over as the blocks for the most part
>have a lot of iron in the walls. It is a cheap fix as
>pistons cost the same from stock to +.060 over.. BUT the
>gottcha is now the engine is too big. The current solution
>is to do 1 of 2 things. Look for a used block that will
>clean with a .010 or 0.020 overbore , buy a new block for
>1000+ or buy a custom crank with a shorter stroke for 2000+
>
>These solutions are either incredibly time consuming or
>expensive. They also apply to most of the small inch stuff
>that is always viewed as 'cheap to race'. Most 2000 cc
>engines are around 1990 cc stock same with 3000cc I am sure
>there are a zillion 1498 cc engines too there are i sure too
>others that are larger that are right on the edge of the
>next class.
>
>A different solution...
>Allow an overbore not to exceed .060 ( that ought to fix the
>worst of the worst engines) so you can run a stock crank and
>save the 2000 or so bucks. For most engines this amounts to
>a few cubic inches. Some one with a calculator handy might
>and i am sure will add to this.
>
>This is personal for me and I won't hide that fact. I have
>no vested interest in the rotary deal i brought up but this
>i do. Keith just mentioned his crank is coming in from
>Bryant. It will be a nice piece i am sure, but an expensive
>one. If he could have bored out the 302 might have not
>needed the crank in the first place or at least not a custom
>stroke one to get under the size limit. I have been looking
>for a 3 liter engine for 2002. None to be found in my book
>because you can't freshen one up for a reasonable cost as
>they are for the most part 2990+ cc stock. If I do no more
>than a service station rebuild i am illegal.. I will grant
>you that most try a little harder than that but the concept
>is the same. There ought to be a way to allow so many cc's
>per cylinder for normal engine rebuilding. I have a 2000 cc
>ford block that is .002 over.. have a lot of time in it and
>it is junk.. just does not seem like it is a reasonable deal
>same with most of the small chevy and FORD guys out there.
>
>So the question is .. Is there anyway top have a bit of a
>window in engine size that precludes spending a ton of money
>to not be a few cubic inches over a set limit????
>
>Doing a little quick math with a 302 FORD as a starting
>point..
>stock is 301.44 with a 4 inch bore 3 inch stroke.
>D class limit is 305
>302 with a .030 overbore .. real common is 306 oops no
>good.. 0.03% over
>
>302 with a .040 overbore less common but safe is 307.5 1.5
>inches 0.09% over
>
>302 with a .060 overbore and probably out of iron in the
>walls..310.55
>So the worst case is less than 2% .. and less than 6
>inches..
>
>The other question is there is 1 cubic inch between classes
>who owns that inch??
>a good example is G class.. up to 2.00 liter F is 2.01 liter
>to 3.0 Where are the 10cc's. I have a FORD 2 liter block
>that will clean at 2008 cc so it is not G or F..
>I was looking at an F engine from another car it is 3 cc
>under 3.0 liter it will clean at 3019 cc another 'black
>hole'.. would clean better at .020 over but that is too big
>for sure but never the less well under the range of FACTORY
>pistons..
>
>Anyone have any great ideas to fix this and help keep the
>cost of racing down??
>
>Just so no one feels left out the FORD examples work for a
>chevy 302 also... :>)
>Dave Dahlgren
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