Those of you that have been to Pittsburgh Vintage GP have seen the big crowd of
spectators there.
Duncan
> On Mar 16, 2018, at 10:09 PM, Bill via Fot <fot at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> I understand there were venues that had lots of spectators, as there are
> today despite other distractions. Club racing was rarely that. I sat in the
> stands with about 60,000 of my closest friends at Ascot Park one night in
> August 1965 when Kenny Roberts demolished everyone. I remember looking over
> my shoulder at Watts burning. A month or so later I raced the same event and
> there were five guys and a dog in the stands.
>
>>
>> Just for the record when I was racing my TR-3 at Santa Barbara the field of
>> cars was over 300 and well past 25,000 spectators each day, lots of college
>> kids. Pomona not quite as many entries but well over 200 and spectators over
>> 20, 000 again. This was the middle and late 50's
>> , Now there are a lot more things to do so the spectators have drifted away
>> and the cars have worn out and proved to expensive to keep up so they have
>> diminished, but it was GRAND in its day like a lot of old stuff.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Never be beaten by equipment.
>>
>>
>> Different strokes I guess. I don?t care what the other cars are as long as
>> I?m having fun. A CRX ruined the aesthetic? How many people were watching
>> the TR3?s run back in the day. I used to go to Thompson and Limerock to
>> watch the sports car races. Me and thirty other people. Sepia toned
>> nostalgia is safe because it doesn?t have to be real.
>>
>> I know plenty of snobs who just think anyone who isn?t doing what they do is
>> wrong.
>>
>>>
>>> Solipsistic?
>>>
>>> I would keep vintage racing if I were racing with TR's and MG's etc. I
>>> went to a race and finished between a X1/9 and a RX7 and said why am I
>>> working so hard to keep my Elva running? Can I race a Dodge Neon or other
>>> POS?
>>>
>>> At the Last VSCDA event there was one Honda CRX in the field. Were these
>>> ever raced? Wait I know they were but NO ONE cared to watch. The CRX
>>> ruined the aesthetic of the field. Please forward my message to the owner
>>> and tell him to get a real car.
>>>
>>> I grew up in the 80's the cars sucked, they still suck. 1000 years shall
>>> pass and they shall still suck. I know very few people who long for those
>>> cars and do not wish to associate with them. Old bad wine, is still bad
>>> wine.
>>>
>>> Remember a Snob is merely one who appreciates that which is, good.
>>>
>>> I do appreciate all Triumphs.
>>>
>>> Cheers, Henry Morrison
>>> Sent from Outlook <http://aka.ms/weboutlook>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2018 10:43 PM
>>> To: Paul Ricco
>>> Cc: Henry A. Morrison; Friends of Triumph
>>> Subject: Re: [Fot] New Cars, New Parts
>>>
>>> I?m trying to figure out what Henry is disagreeing with, or what Paul is
>>> saying. If you?re leaving vintage racing, why would you care what the rules
>>> are or what cars the organizations permit? And if vintage racing is dying,
>>> then how is accepting 80?s cars selling out for the entry fee? If you
>>> started racing in 86, then the cars from 1950 (probably older than whatever
>>> you raced) were 36 years old. Cars from 1980 are 38 years old. Does vintage
>>> mean just those cars that were cool when you were a kid? That?s a bit too
>>> solipsistic for me.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Henry,
>>>>
>>>> Well put. We have really enjoyed 30 years of vintage racing and club
>>>> racing. However, I am seriously considering retiring from Vintage Racing
>>>> after this season and going back to club racing. I loved the open spirit
>>>> of CanAm in the day, but that is not what I got into vintage racing a
>>>> vintage 60?s era sports car for.
>>>>
>>>> We may give our race TR4 a well deserved frame off restoration and it can
>>>> be preserved as closely to the way it was raced during the late 60?s and
>>>> 70?s as possible. It can enjoy some restful retirement time with some of
>>>> the others that we really care for. We can focus our energy on prepping
>>>> another race car for Midwest Council or SCCA Club Racing, and not have to
>>>> deal with some of the dilemma?s that we are facing with car prep for
>>>> vintage. Most club racing organizations have made it very simple. If the
>>>> rule book does not say that you can make a specific modification, than you
>>>> cannot make it. It makes things a lot simpler.
>>>>
>>>> Paul
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I just can't disagree with this statement more.
>>>>> 1. Vintage racing is dying. There are way fewer cars and races than
>>>>> there were in 1986 when I started.
>>>>> 2. The newer cars and drivers scarcely know what a road course is.
>>>>> Car culture was different after '72 and especially now, just look at the
>>>>> current Fast and furious movies that sell the current car culture.
>>>>> 3. how many old TR gearboxes from my personal collection would you
>>>>> like to have delivered to your place tomorrow? Or buy some of the ones on
>>>>> ebay for $150, that seems to be the going rate.
>>>>> 4. Clubs that accept cars from the 80's are selling out for the
>>>>> entry fee, and in doing so driving me away in the process.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have a great racing season,
>>>>>
>>>>> Henry Morrison, Albuquerque, NM
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from Outlook <http://aka.ms/weboutlook>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> It is good to see that other clubs are allowing newer cars into their
>>>>> races. VARA has been doing this for several years so that we could
>>>>> survive, keep the club solvent and the cost of racing reasonable. The
>>>>> future of vintage racing is an expansion to cars from the 80?s and 90?s,
>>>>> they are long past their prime in other venues, cheap and they bring in
>>>>> new drivers. They are in fact ?vintage?, like our cars were in the 80?
>>>>> and 90?s. More important, these are the guys and gals that lusted for a
>>>>> certain hot car of the that era and now have older kids and the bucks to
>>>>> go racing. Without these folks our sport will pass along with us.
>>>>>
>>>>> The same is true of parts. Much of our equipment is worn out and not
>>>>> maintainable without great cost and effort any longer. Gear boxes are an
>>>>> example. I am down to my last good transmission case for my dog box.
>>>>> When that goes, or the gear set is toast, I am making the switch to a
>>>>> modern box (same ratios) that I can maintain. Like many of us I have
>>>>> missed races because of transmission failures. Tony runs a Ford 8?
>>>>> because he doesn?t want to get hurt, and it is bullet proof for racing,
>>>>> even has a weight penalty. A gear box switch is inevitable if we want
>>>>> to keep our cars on track at an expenditure of time and money that makes
>>>>> sense.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are tons of other parts that make engines last longer (and yes they
>>>>> make more power). An old TR motor is nothing but half a Chevy Small
>>>>> Block; those guys spent hundreds of millions developing motor parts that
>>>>> we can take advantage of. Same is true of blueprinting techniques, there
>>>>> are much better ways to build engines than ?back in the day? and if you
>>>>> read a book and learn how to do it the bloody lump lasts twice as long.
>>>>> Last time I had my motor out I could have put the coated bearings with 25
>>>>> races on them back in. At 36 races I had <5% leak down on the rings and
>>>>> valves. Started out building the old school way, with old school parts,
>>>>> those days are over as I don?t have the time to spend five days in the
>>>>> shop for every day at the track.
>>>>>
>>>>> Oil. There is no such thing as cheap racing oil. Modern oil is the best
>>>>> it has ever been and makes the motor last. I had technical help from
>>>>> Lake Speed who is the ?man? for Joe Gibbs Driven race oil. The stuff is
>>>>> $18 a quart but will last 500+ miles in the car (4-6 race weekends).
>>>>> Just change the filter after every race and add on quart, total cost
>>>>> $30.00. I can run all the way down to 27 wt. (mixing) but just run the
>>>>> 30 wt. racing oil even at +100 degrees in the desert and the oil pressure
>>>>> is always spot on. Tight clearances, light oil and great bearing life,
>>>>> well worth the cost.
>>>>>
>>>>> My point in all of this is that ?vintage? racing is changing, both the
>>>>> cars and the people. We are going to have to accept and adapt or slowly
>>>>> see our sport fade. They willalways be a special place for those cars
>>>>> with a 50 year race history, prepared exactly like it raced in 1965.
>>>>> For the rest of the grid, and those of us that don?t have cars with
>>>>> history, there are going to be cars with certain changes that get us to
>>>>> the track. Besides some of us are just SoCal Hot Rodders at heart with a
>>>>> touch of ?good ole boy? NACAR ingenuity. Now I need to get back to work
>>>>> on that 85% scale TR-4 body in aluminum, or possible carbon
>>>>> fiber???..Everyone have a great 2018 season racing!
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>
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