Don't forget 148 pc
"Michael R. Clements" wrote:
>
> Thanks for the VC reference.
>
> It says drivers are required to submit to any "lawful order" and any "lawful
> inspection". It doesn't mean you have to do everything a police officer
> tells you to do. The key word here is "lawful".
>
> For example, _if_ (I repeat, "if") VC section 2814 is a violation of
> "unreasonable search" provisions in the Federal Constitution, or a violation
> of the presumption of innocence guaranteed by the Federal Constitution, then
> Federal law overrides state law and the inspection is no longer lawful.
> Thus, the driver need not submit.
>
> One can also question what it means to "submit". When I have been subjected
> to this kind of thing in the past, I did not physically resist their attempt
> to search me or my car, but I told them they did not have my permission to
> do so. When one refuses to grant permission, but makes no physical
> resistance, is this considered failure to submit?
>
> The officers told me to continue on my way without searching me or my car.
> Maybe they were nice guys, maybe their commanding officers told them to do
> that to avoid bad press or possible lawsuits. Or maybe I just looked
> innocent and sober and it wasn't worth their time to deal with me.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-ba-autox@autox.team.net
> [mailto:owner-ba-autox@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Kenneth Allan
> Mitchell
> Sent: Friday, August 10, 2001 19:30
> To: Michael R. Clements
> Cc: John J. Stimson-III; jeff; ba-autox@autox.team.net
> Subject: Re: Fw: CA Special Alert
>
> Please read 2800 and 2814 vc
>
> "Michael R. Clements" wrote:
> >
> > Personally, the portion of the law that I would contest is if officers can
> > do it indiscriminately. In general, the law should require that no officer
> > can ever detain anybody at any time, unless the officer has a "damn good
> > reason". This would include (a) a warrant, or (b) probable cause.
> >
> > In the example you give, the clouds of thick smoke would constitute
> probable
> > cause. A general roadblock does not meet either of these conditions and
> > should thus be illegal (IMO, of course).
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-ba-autox@autox.team.net
> > [mailto:owner-ba-autox@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of John J. Stimson-III
> > Sent: Friday, August 10, 2001 10:51
> > To: jeff
> > Cc: ba-autox@autox.team.net
> > Subject: Re: Fw: CA Special Alert
> >
> > Huh. So it is the opinion of the NMA that if a cop sees a car going
> > down the road pouring forth thick clouds of smoke, it should be
> > illegal for the cop to pull that car over?
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 10, 2001 at 08:43:03AM -0700, jeff wrote:
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Eric Skrum (National Motorists Association)" <nma@motorists.org>
> > > To: "National Motorists Association" <nma@motorists.org>
> > > Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 12:31 PM
> > > Subject: CA Special Alert
> > >
> > >
> > > > Dear CA Members,
> > > >
> > > > A program is being implemented by the State of California which should
> > > cause
> > > > concern to all motorists and vehicle owners. A section in the
> California
> > > > Vehicle Code, Health and Safety Code section 44081, allows your car to
> > be
> > > > stopped for a smog equipment and emissions inspection. This was
> recently
> > > > reported by NMA member Nestor Valdes. On June 27, in Camarillo, a
> > > roadblock
> > > > was set up and vehicles were pulled over for inspection and testing.
> The
> > > > actual wording in the code says "The procedures may include pullovers
> > for
> > > > roadside emissions testing and inspection."
> > > >
> > > > If this concerns you, and it should, please take action by
> communicating
> > > > your thoughts to the Governor and to your elected representatives in
> the
> > > > California Senate and in the Assembly. We need to jump on this
> quickly,
> > > > before it spreads to all areas of the State. In your letters, e-mails,
> > and
> > > > phone calls, please reference the above California Vehicle Code #
> 44081.
> > > >
> > > > You can visit http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/index.html to find the contact
> > > > information for your elected representatives.
> > > >
> > > > You can visit http://www.ca.gov/state/portal/myca_homepage.jsp to find
> > the
> > > > Governor's home page and his contact information.
> > > >
> > > > Thank you
> > > >
> > > > Jim Thomas
> > > > CA Activist
> > > > fastestdog@prodigy.net
> >
> > --
> >
> > john@idsfa.net John Stimson
> > http://www.idsfa.net/~john/ HMC Physics '94
>
> --
> Kenneth Allan Mitchell
> mailto:nokones@kenmitchell.com
--
Kenneth Allan Mitchell
mailto:nokones@kenmitchell.com
|